quote:

Originally posted by gloriarex:
So people edit their tapes until they're perfect in order to get invited. Then they play the live audition where they don't sound half as good as their tape and get eliminated.

I would guess that of the thousands of tapes that are sent to orchestras each year, maybe 3 of them might have that result due to editing.

"Editing" tapes has been going on since the wax cylinder. There is still an extremely finite amount you can do to one. You can't make a crappy player into Junior Heifetz, that's a common myth.

One has had the ability to "edit" their own tapes for 100 years. Err, just play it over. You can mess up and do it over and over till the cows come home. An excerpt is 30 seconds.

You cant edit tone, musicality, and you probably can't edit rhythm unless you have serious engineering chops. You can edit pitch on a note here and there, but the person has to play 99% in tune to begin with or else it won't help. Most editing is really simple, people are splicing two takes into one.

Ironically, the biggest "cheating" device is not only totally legal but encouraged: a concert hall. The best gear on the planet won't come close to emulating a good hall, not by a longshot.

Think about it: some kid in a practice room against someone in Symphony hall? The disparity will be enormous, even how the player approaches it. Now THAT'S unfair. I'm sure every musician on this forum has heard their orchestra in the el crappo auditorium, then at the big fancypants hall on tour (unless you are lucky enough to call it home). The difference is huge, the players play better. It's luxurious!

I've only run into one problem with a tape, and it was at a summer school I taught at. The faculty awarded a student a scholarship based on his tape. When he arrived, it was painfully obvious that he was not the player on the tape.

The person who has the bucks to rent/sneak into a good hall with a decent engineer will always have a huge advantage, editing or not. The kid with the lil disc recorder in the practice room will never get close to the same result, even if the tape is edited note by note.

Direct Note Access.

Auditioning via tape is like having a typewriting competition via email.

I always imagined that the AFM could play a role in audition taping. Audition rules and recording practices could be standardized and many locals around the country used as recording sites. At the player's convenience a date could be scheduled at the closest union local and the recording retained by the Union to be shared (with musician approval) with orchestras for their screening process. It would almost be like the Youtube Symphony. The reason it would never work is because each orchestra wants its own specific repertoire and selection process.

quote:

Originally posted by bsnmusic:
Direct Note Access.

The number of players that Have a PT rig is probably 1 in 10,000 or so. Like anything else it is a learned skill, and in reality it's going to cost some serious bucks to have someone auto-tuning audition tapes. It also can leave noticable digital artifacts. As I said earlier, I would rather have access to a great hall than melodyne.

quote:

always imagined that the AFM could play a role in audition taping. Audition rules and recording practices could be standardized and many locals around the country used as recording sites.

It's a decent idea, except that mic placement, proper gain staging and levels etc. is an artform as well. One union would have a reverberant room with hardwood floors while another sticks you in the boiler room. One might have the mic 50 feet way while another has it 3 feet away.

There is also a matter of trust. In a real audition you get one shot. If you went to the union hall, it should be the same. However, I can easily see how one could bend the rules for a friend.

I would be pleased to see American orchestras reimburse the cost of plane tickets for finalists like they do in many European orchestras. I am not sure I like the idea of the AFM recording auditions, but remunerating finalists would be a practical solution. (And who knows, orchestras might even feel inclined to hire a little more frequently).

I would agree with many of the replies that just going through the process of making a recording for a required tape round can be helpful to one's playing/preparation. Listening to your recorded playing is insightful and can sometimes be painful. The recorder doesn't lie! However, unless one's recording has the playing level good enough for the final round (ie. perfection?), one would not pass the tape round. Perhaps some of you have passed a tape round with less than perfect playing.

If I were on the jury to judge a tape round, why would I pass someone who's recorded playing was good enough to pass the 1st or maybe even the semifinal round but probably wouldn't cut it for the finals? Why waste someone's time/$$ to come to the audition if I didn't think that person probably wouldn't go the distance? I don't know. Perhaps you may think otherwise. Although I've made a cd of excerpts, I've never submitted it for a tape round for the very reasons stated above.

I think that mentality is the reason that tape rounds are unsuccessful. Too many people looking for perfection, and trying to pick a winner out of what is, in effect, a pre-preliminary round.

How many people who won jobs played perfect auditions? A recent percussion audition asked for 20 minutes of rep in a continuous take. Regardless of how many takes one has, playing that much rep isn't likely to yield a completely flawless product for anyone.

Additionally, tapes cannot completely represent a person's playing, especially their concept of sound (or lack thereof). In my opinion, a tape round should be used simply to weed out those who obviously have no chance at advancing past the FIRST round, and everyone should be invited to invest their own money in taking the audition.

In most cases, simply asking for a tape deters many of those who didn't really have a shot at the job in the first place, so we should be seeing much higher tape success rates than we presently do.

I know of one teacher who has recently advised current and former students to appeal non-invites before submitting a tape. Recent results suggest that the chances of getting invited to an audition from a tape round lie somewhere in the improbable-impossible range.